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Living Metal feedback

 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 5:20 pm 
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Ah, good point.

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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 7:46 pm 
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I have played 7 games total with my Necrons. I have won 3 and lost 4. I haven't found LM to be overpowered yet. I probably haven't played them to their best though. It was the first army I took up when getting back into epic and I've only played them ones the last year.

There's one thing I'd change though Ulrik. I'd remove the part about TK(>1) automatically becoming TK(1). I think it's over the top and it feels a bit like cheating. That would make the rule slightly less powerful and would make the WE somewhat more vulnerable.

cheers


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 8:00 pm 
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Borka wrote:
There's one thing I'd change though Ulrik. I'd remove the part about TK(>1) automatically becoming TK(1). I think it's over the top and it feels a bit like cheating. That would make the rule slightly less powerful and would make the WE somewhat more vulnerable.


Thanks for the feedback. It's on the table, as part of the EUK change. I'm mostly interested in the effect on Pylons primarily, and also C'tan. Big harvesters should probably be balanced around whatever rule works for the smaller engines.


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:13 pm 
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I peronally think that whatever you do witrh the rest of LM, it should precisely keep that aspect. This is what gives it flavour, and makes C'Tan near unkillable, as they should be.

If it's considered too strong, just make the big harvesters with less DC.

Pylons are balcned in NetEA imho. and if the EUK save in integrated, which I don't think is necessary, then the TK is decued to TK(1) should be kept.

Cheers,

LotM

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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 7:47 pm 
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So got 3 tournament games in today playing with four formations of three Monoliths and two Pylons. One win against Rug's artillery company, war hounds and shadowswords. MoK's siege masters mass of activations. And RichardL's Iyanden reinforced saves.

I had a win, a lose and a draw. I only faced one Titan killer shot in the three games so the one save didn't mean much. All other saves were normal or from MW. Overall I'd say that the saves even out over the three games, just wish they had been closer in each of the tyre games, but that's just my competitive nature. Great bug different games all three.


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 9:29 am 
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Let me add a little bit more to what I last posted. The game against the guard was very cagey with both of us trying not to expose too much of our force to the other too soon. This meant that there was actually very little shooting and when the monoliths were involved it was usually in a firefight. Only one monolith was killed in this game and dice rolls were above average.

Second game against Siege Masters had Ryan blocking off a corner of the battlefield. Again there was a lot of posturing with the Monoliths mainly being left alone except to be fired upon to be broken. The loss of infantry here was more of a problem and I think that I lost 4 monoliths to shooting and firefights. Dice were more average and the monoliths didn't seem over powered. 17 -10 activations caused the real problem especially with 3+ bunker saves stopping my forces almost dead. However the resiliance and reanimation allowed me to take the game to a draw.

Third game against alot of Macro Weapons from the Iyanden was a slaughter fest for the whole of the Necrons. I went big teleporting all my monoliths onto one flank along with the C'tan. Initiative was lost, C'tan was killed and the Iyanden moved away from me quicker than I could catch up. Game swung heavily in the Iyanden's favour with more MW hits being rolled in engagements than normal and below average saves being made. Necrons lost whilst surrounding the enemy Blitz with everything they had left to minimise the loss. Over half the monoliths were killed in this game.

Simpe conclusions are they living metal rocks when only beening lightly tested, but when faced with Iyanden & possibly waves of shooting they crubble as normal.


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 10:14 am 
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Tiny-Tim wrote:
Third game against alot of Macro Weapons from the Iyanden was a slaughter fest for the whole of the Necrons.<snip>

Simpe conclusions are they living metal rocks when only beening lightly tested, but when faced with Iyanden & possibly waves of shooting they crubble as normal.


In the game against Iyanden, would you say that you would have been in even more trouble with a lesser amount of monoliths (say 6)?

Do you think you could have won with a bit more luck, or was the large amounts of MWs crippling your Monoliths even if the Iyanden player had rolled a bit more average?


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 10:25 am 
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Ulrik wrote:
In the game against Iyanden, would you say that you would have been in even more trouble with a lesser amount of monoliths (say 6)?

Yes, I suffered from having Monoliths breaking and then not rallying whilst off the table, with half the number of formations I would have been crippled by this.

Ulrik wrote:
Do you think you could have won with a bit more luck, or was the large amounts of MWs crippling your Monoliths even if the Iyanden player had rolled a bit more average?

Of course, gamers can always do with more favour from the Lady. I went big to start off with and it didn't work, I really needed to win the first turn activation which on the +2 for the Iyanden was not my best of decisions. Losing my C'tan hurt as when I had my first chance to do anything I promptly failed the activation..... However, I think this evened up for when the LatD beat a slightly different version of this list at the last tournament in Manchester.


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:50 pm 
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Finally played that game with massed MW ranged attacks (and semi-UK LM rule). At least as close as I could get.

3000 points. I played Ulthwé, with Revenants and a formation of 2 Scorpions (using the current playtest rules, so 3 attacks each at 2+, 450 pts). Also had 2x mounted Black Guardians, 1x Guardians with platforms and Seer Council, 2x Falcons/Fire Storms, War Walkers and a Swooping Hawk Troupe. My opponent showed up with a to me untraditional army, an Abattoir, 2 formations of 2 Monoliths and 2 Obelisks, 2 Warrior Phalanxes, a Pylon and 2 formations of Destroyers (one normal, one heavy).

His plan was to move his Abattoir straight into the heart of my army and support it with the Monoliths teleporting in beside it. That did play right into my hands, but it wasn't the disaster I'd have expected. First turn nothing teleported whlie the Abattoir took cover behind a hill in the middle, Eldar cautiously advanced. Second turn the Monoliths teleported into two craters on the Eldar half (counts as rubble). Eldar won strategy, and used Farsight to hammer them with Scorpions, Revenants and War Walkers. One monolith left in one formation, only one obelisk dead in the other. Abattoir assaulted War Walkers (dead walkers) and positioned itself to support more assaults. Heavy destroyers killed one Scorpion, but a Warrior formation failed their initiative and moved out into a crater to be ready for next turn (he was getting low on portals). The other two remaining portals were killed before they could be used, and all obelisks and monoliths were dead at the end of turn 2. Turn 3 Necrons won initiative, and used it to kill both Black Guardian formations in assault (Abattoir engaged one, supported the assault on the other). The Avatar engaged and broke the first warrior formation (the second had just killed a BG fm and moved to the Blitz). Normal guardians failed activation test to engage heavy destroyers, and were instead engaged and broken by the destroyers (Seer Council survived). After that it was pretty much over, Scorpion moved to contest the blitz and put some more damage on the Abattoir (it had taken a few hits in assaults and at the end of turn 2), Revenants finished it off. Eldar now had 3 fms that threatened an objective each, while the Necrons only had a single destroyer formation left to activate. Destroyers protected their own Blitz, but the Eldar easily claimed Take & Hold for a 2-0 win.

The Necrons had fewer portals than they could have had, and threw their Portals straight into heavy MW fire. They still managed to deploy all but one of their formations on the far side of the table (one destroyer fm entered from the Tomb Complex). Even if they were never really close to winning, it wasn't as one-sided as I'd have thought before we played.


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:40 pm 
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Can you crosspost any thoughts to the appropriate Eldar threads?

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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 12:31 am 
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Only played Necrons once with a Guard and Marine mixed list (Saranes Expanse). It was a close game which we decided I'd narrowly lost (it was getting late so we talked out turn 4 rather than playing it). At the end of turn 3 I was one objective up, and would have been 2 up (and won) with a little more luck.
I lost that game through a couple of poor decisions and one or two dice rolls which went against me at crucial times. LM played it's part but I didn't feel it was unfair. My Shadowswords had little to do other than park on an objective but that was different. Usually they play a major role.
I had to play differently against Necrons which was why I enjoyed it and will definitely be looking forward to playing them again.


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 7:47 am 
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Got a 3000pt game in on Wednesday against Black Legion using the Epic-UK list. As there was no TK in the opposing army the Living Metal rule just ended up being like Reinforced Armour. My rolling was rather good and I only lost a Pylon and 2 out of 9 Monoliths to failed saves.


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 11:30 am 
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How much MW did your LM units get hit with, Tim?

And so nice to see that someone is playing Necrons at least :) I'm starting to get the feeling that they've hardly been played at all this year!


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 12:12 pm 
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Yes, I don't get to play that much with having a lot of different armies. I was facing 2 Decimators, Terminators (6) and some Sorceror Lords as the main MW so we are only talking 4-5 hits, Excluding the terminators that just crushed a Pylon in their powerfists.


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 Post subject: Re: Living Metal feedback
PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 12:39 pm 
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While Pylons are more vulnerable to Terminators with new LM, I'm not sure that's a bad thing - the Marine player is using his elite 400 pt teleport formation (that is then stuck walking) against your 200 pt formation after all...


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