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Oh No they say he's got to.........

 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2003 1:47 am 
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Hi!

Netepic is correct, in its "golden age" epic was between 12-14%, at least in the US, I used to retail back then so I remember figures from that time well. As time went by it slipped to under 10% (as low as 7% I was told). Epic 40k was supposed to remedy that, in the US they were pitching for a 15%, at least that was the propaganda fed to the independent stockist. It never came even close, about 6 months after release sales were pretty much dead.

Maksim, no worries, get me them when you can. I appreciate the help.

Legion4, no worries, people will play whatever they want, always have always will. But us old foggies from the net epic list love to bitch and moan about GW attitudes regarding epic. Its a shame that the effort going on now wasn't the one done when epic 40k came out, things might have been quite different. But as they say "water under the bridge".

Of course regardless of game system we all do talk a common, the love of epic minis! There is no question the quality of the minis are a lot better overall with some exceptions (eldar titans anyone? Bleh).

Who said we may never play? I still harbor my insane idea of a independent epic convention, who knows it may be near you!

Primarch

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2003 5:19 am 
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Oh yes, Tom & Primarch, I remember the heady days of the SM2 time frame when Epic was one of the "favorite sons".  And I remember I was not all that taken with it because I was a hard-corps SM1 player.  But we evolved :D !   And use a hybrid system as I stated many (too many) times before.  I've been playing war games since '70 in one form or another so I'm sure I'm in the old foggies category, (and proud of it  :cool: !)  That being said, I always welcome the interaction on the Forums and look forward to them and E-A.  4-5 years from now we'll be having a similar discussion about E-B :o !  Legion 4

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2005 10:53 pm 
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You are not really going to be able to pull this one off unless you have a gaming friend, or friends, that; (A) Have a real good sense of humor; (B) Really likes challenges; © Is more interested in having fun over winning. If you are lucky and you do then read on, but no scrolling down to the bottom to see how the story ends you?ll enjoy it more if you read it through. Trust me!

Call your friend(s) up and say that you have put together a small ladder campaign that you need to use to playtest a new army list, and that you would like their help. Be up front and tell them the army they?ll be facing is totally new, and comes with a small catch, you cannot tell them anything about it, it?s special rules, it?s unit data sheet, or anything, because you need a totally frank assessment and revealing any of that information would ruin said assessment. Also explain that being a playtest of both the mini-ladder campaign and a new army that it is probably not very well balanced. If they agree then get ready to have some fun.

Opponents Campaign Preperations

Tell your friend(s) that they need to put together a 3,000 point army list for the first scenario of the campaign, and that this will be the core list for the next two scenarios to be fought in the campaign, the only restriction is that no spacecraft can be taken.

For the second scenario tell them they can change 1,000 points of troops from the core list that was used in the first scenario. This must be done in complete formations, cannot be below 1,000 points, and cannot go above 1,200 points. The formations used in this sub list can be duplicates of formations removed from the core army, if they wish, just as long as the core list and this list are noted separately for the second scenario.

For the third scenario tell them they can change 1,000 points of troops from the entire list that was used in the second scenario. This must be done in complete formations, cannot be below 1,000 points, and cannot go above 1,200 points. The formations used in this sub list can be duplicates of formations removed from those used in the entire second scenarios? army, if they wish, just as long as the core list and this list are noted separately for the third scenario.

Tell them they must arrive to play the campaign with all three lists ready to go, and that they will not be able to change them once the campaign starts. Tell them also not to worry the battles will not last that long and that we will probably get the entire campaign done in a couple of hours (4 to 6 hours is average, trust me).

The Campaign Scenarios, in order.......

Scenario #1 ?The Destruction of Power Plant #186?
(Use a 4? x 6? Table)
Background
Two days ago all communication with the Turoch Mine was lost and local command is concerned that their are now Eldar or Ork Pirates in the area. Your forces have been sent to sweep the area, find the perpetrators, and eliminate them, while protecting Power Plant #186 from them.

Terrain Set Up
You set up the terrain in any way you like, as per standard GT rules, but you cannot use a river or any buldings. Then tell your friend(s) to pick either short table edge as their baseline, and then tell them the opposite short edge will be your table edge.

Opponents Set Up
Give your opponent(s) one building and tell them to place it anywhere on their baseline as they would a Blitz objective. Tell them that this is your objective for this scenario and all they need to do is protect it.

Tell them to deploy up to 1/3 of their army, in points and complete formations, anywhere that is at least 60cms from your table edge, and not more then 75cms from that same table edge. Tell them the rest of their army arrives on turn one moving in at any point along their baseline.

Your Set Up
You deploy your forces 15cms in from your table edge after your friend(s) are finished deploying their forces (Remember no scrolling down yet to see just what those forces are!).

Victory Conditions
Tell your friend(s) that all they have to do is keep you from destroying the Power Plant by the end of the fourth turn. If they do then they win both the battle and the campaign.

Scenario #2 ?Hold The Line?
(Use a 4? x 6? Table)
Background
With the destruction of the Power Plant your surviving forces have withdrawn to this area in an attempt to prevent the enemy from getting to the town of Krasnygorad, and it?s people. Reinforcements are being rushed to the area to aid you in this effort.

Terrain Set Up
You set up the terrain in any way you like, as per standard GT rules, but you cannot use a river or any buldings. Then tell your friend(s) to pick either short table edge as their baseline, and then tell them the opposite short edge will be your table edge.

Opponents Set Up
Tell your friend(s) to divide up their core forces into two separate ?commands? with each command containing at least 650 points of troops in complete formations. After they have done this tell them to deploy the largest command, in points, at least 30cms from your table edge, but no more then 45cms from your table edge. Then tell them to deploy the second command, the smaller one in points and complete formations, at least 60cms from your table edge, but not more then 75cms from that same table edge. Tell them that the separate 1,000 point block they created arrives on turn one moving in at any point along their baseline.

Your Set Up
You deploy your forces 15cms in from your table edge after your friend(s) are finished deploying their forces (Uh, Uh, Uh, Remember no scrolling down yet to see just what those forces are!).

Victory Conditions
Tell your friends all they have to do is keep you from moving your forces off their chosen taqble edge before the end of turn four. If they do then they win both the battle and the campaign.

Scenario #3 ?The Defense of Krasnygorad?
(Use a 4? x 6? Table)
Background
Our forces have failed to save the power plant, and haven?t been able to drive the enemy off. Now we have no choice but to dig our heels in and protect the town long enough for it?s people to escape.

Terrain Set Up
You set up the terrain in any way you like, as per standard GT rules, but you cannot use a river or any buldings. Then tell your friend(s) to pick either short table edge as their baseline, and then tell them the opposite short edge will be your table edge. Once this is done give your friend(s) seven buildings and tell them to place them so that all of them are within 60cms of their table edge, so that every building is within 20cms of another two buildings, and where no building is within 15cms of another building.

Opponents Deployment
Tell your friend to deploy their core forces anywhere on the table that is not within 30cms of your table edge, and at least 75cms away from their own table edge. Then tell them to deploy the 1,000 point they created anywhere that puts them within 15cms of a building.

Your Deployment
You deploy your forces 15cms in from your table edge after your friend(s) are finished deploying their forces (Hey you made it this far so no scrolling down yet to see just what those forces are!).

Victory Conditions
Tell your friend(s) that they have to keep you from destroying all seven buildings before the end of turn six. If they do they win the battle and the campaign.

Now

Scroll

Down

To

See

What

Your

Army

Is



King of the Monsters
Strategy Rating: 1+
Initiative Rating: 1+

Godzilla (WE)
Speed Armor Close Combat Fire Fight
 10cm   4+             3+                 3+
Weapons Range     Firepower
SuF Atomic Breath 45cm 8xBPMWTKD3 AA4+ (FxF)
Adv Atomic Breath 45cm 4xBPMWTKD3 AA5+ (FxF)
Dbl Atomic Breath 45cm 3xBPMWTKD3 AA6+ (FxF)
Tail Swipe (15cm) CC or FF MWTKD3 (RxR)
Claw Attacks CC 2xCCMW (FxF)
Notes: DC 15, Reinforced Armor, Fearless, Walker, Thick Rear Armor, 6xActivations, Regenerates, Animal Instincts

G1.0 Godzilla Special Rules

G1.1 Activations
Each turn Godzilla gets to use six activations, in other words treat him like he was six separate formations. Godzilla cannot retain, and cannot take back to back activations unless no enemy formations remain to activate. Otherwise treat Godzilla like a normal formation as far as activating, orders, and movement are concerned.

G1.2 Regenerate
If Godzilla takes a Marshal Action roll as normal to remove BMs, but in addition Godzilla gets to back a number of lost DCs equal to the roll of a 1D3. So yes in a Marshal Action Godzilla removes 1D6 BMs, and gets back 1D3 lost DCs.

In the Rally Phase Godzilla removes BMs as normal, and he gets back up to three lost DCs. Even if Godzilla fails his Rally roll he still gets the three free lost DCs back. In all cases Godzilla cannot get back more DCs then he starts with.

G1.3 Atomic Breath
The type of Atomic Breath attack Godzilla gets to use is based upon whatever his order is for that activation.
SuF (Sustained Fire): Use this line for the Breath Weapon and Godzilla does not get a +1 to hit for being on sustained fire.
Adv (Advance): Use this line for the Breath Attack and Godzilla gets a normal attack, no modifiers.
Dbl (Double and Marshal): Use this line for the Breath Weapon and Godzilla does not get a -1 to hit for either the Double or the Marshal action.
Godzilla?s AA attack is based upon whatever order he is on when it is used, at the start of each turn treat his AA attack as if he was on sustained.

G1.4 Animal Instincts
If Godzilla is Broken, or fails an Initiative Test, then roll 1D6 and consult the chart below when it is Godzilla?s turn to activate. After rolling carry out the action designated by the roll.
(1) Godzilla goes on a Sustained Fire action, turns to face the nearest enemy formation. Then roll 1D6, and on a roll of 4+ Godzilla shoots at that formation. If Godzilla is broken he cannot shoot.

(2) Godzilla goes on an Advance Order and moves toward the nearest enemy formation, he will not enter any units ZOC, but will stop outside it instead. Then roll 1D6, and on a roll of 4+ Godzilla shoots at that formation. If Godzilla is broken he cannot shoot.

(3) Godzilla goes on an Double Order and moves toward the nearest enemy formation, he will not enter any units ZOC, but will stop outside it. Then roll 1D6, and on a roll of 4+ Godzilla shoots at that formation. If Godzilla is broken he cannot shoot.

(4) Godzilla goes on an Engage Order and moves to engage the nearest enemy formation, and will enter enemy ZOCs, and will attempt to get into base contact with that enemy formation. Godzilla will barge to get his full movement. If Godzilla gets within 15cms of the target formation then an assault is carried out, if Godzilla doesn?t get within 15cms of the target formation that?s it his action for this round is over.

(5) Godzilla goes on a Marshal Order, carries out a rally as normal, and then moves toward the nearest enemy formation. Godzilla will not enter any units ZOC, but will stop outside it instead. If Godzilla is Broken then carry out a rally as you would for the end phase, yes that?s right Godzilla can rally in the middle of the turn, and if he is successful then he will move toward the nearest enemy formation and will not enter any units ZOC, but will stop outside it instead. If Godzilla fails to rally from being broken he does nothing.

(6) Godzilla goes on a Marshal Order, carries out a rally as normal, and then shoots at the nearest enemy formation. If Godzilla is Broken then carry out a rally as you would for the end phase, yes that?s right Godzilla can rally in the middle of the turn, and if he is successful then he shoots at the nearest enemy formation. If Godzilla fails to rally from being broken he does nothing.

G1.4 Destroying Buildings
To destroy a building Godzilla must carry out an assault CC on the building. If the building contains troops he ignores them as all of his attacks are going to be used against the building. If troops are between Godzilla and the building he barges through those troops to get to the building, Godzilla may only do this if he makes base contact with the building.

The Building is treated as the target formation of Godzilla?s assault so all other troops are treated as providing supporting fires only, though if they have been barged they use their CC instead of their FF attack. Carry out all supporting attacks FIRST and if Godzilla isn?t killed or broken by these attacks (getting 1xBM for each lost DC immediately) then he automatically destroys the building, no roll needed. If troops are in the building when it is destroyed they make a normal save to see if they survive it?s destruction. Replace the former intact building with a rubbled building, or just rubble.

Overview of Campaign

Be kind to your friend(s) after you have pulled the Godzilla model out and placed it on the table in the first scenario. Tell them it is Godzilla, he is treated as a WE, has a movement of 10cms, has six activations to use each turn, has a Strategy Rating of one, and an Initiative Rating of one. Tell them from that point on they will have to learn what he is capable of by fighting against him.

Now in the first scenario you actually hold all the cards as your friend(s) have no idea what is going to work against this monster. This should give you more then enough of an edge to cut right through them and destroy the Power Plant in plenty of time, while they experiment trying to stop you.

Things get a bit tougher in the second scenario because your friend(s) will have developed a plan to deal with Godzilla, and while the counters they use may not be totally effective, they will definitely be better organized going about it. This alone is going to make things tougher on you, just hope they don?t stumble on a real good tactic to slow you down, in the end you should still be able to get off the opposite table edge.

In the last scenario your friend(s) will have finally developed some effective tactics, and discovered at least one of your weaknesses, and you can count on them exploiting it to the max. Also you have to destroy all seven buildings before the end of turn six which means you have to get into town before the end of turn four cause it is going to take at least two turns to destroy all of the buildings.

Advice? I am not going to give you any, hey you?ve already got a big advantage to start with!

Good Luck, and have Fun, I did.

Jaldon :oo

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:24 am 
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Nice !

However, with the guys I play with you would have to change Godzilla for a normal army for there to be a twist at the end of that campaign. :p

Still, I admire you for working out the rules for Godzilla - we would just fudge a result as we played it out.  

"...more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules."

"The only rules that really matter are these: what a man can do and what a man can't do."

"You didn't beat me. You ignored the rules of engagement. In a fair fight, I'd kill you."
"That's not much incentive for me to fight fair, then, is it?"

etc. ad nauseam.

Orde

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:27 am 
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Hilarious. Rules for Godzilla! I wonder if you could do a recreation of the Godzilla vs. Mecha-Godzilla movie! ;)

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:09 am 
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Oh Tas and Maksim will love this ! :laugh:

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:38 am 
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Oh yes! Indeed I do! :D

Will have to think about the Godzilla abilities though, and that is a LOT of activations. If he was to double move and attack each time, he could run up and down the board with impunity....not be the slow lumbering beast of legend.  How does it play?

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 7:09 am 
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Sounds fun... I wonder if I could get friends to play this... it would take lots of beer for bribery I think :D  Having multiple players on the defending side could increase the hilarity too.

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 7:28 am 
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ooh, me likes :D :D :D

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 10:46 am 
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Hi!

I'm most definantly going to try this out!

I've even got an old godzilla figure I can use!

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:52 pm 
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GORZIRRA !!! :o (Nippon Translation) [not Klingon] :laugh: :;):

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:55 pm 
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Gojirra or Gojira I believe is the spelling used.

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:57 pm 
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I'll make a note of that !  Thanks ! :D :laugh: :;):

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 4:39 pm 
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In line with the "odd games we play" a friend of mine told me one over the weekend.  This is the same friend who used to order thousands of dollars of GHQ stuff at a time.

His gaming group used to play "Artillery golf."

They used an 8'x16' table and laid out a 9-hole golf course (greens, fairways, the works).  Each player had a golfer and a caddy - 1 arty piece and a light vehicle.

The goal, as in normal golf, is to complete the course with the fewest number of strokes.  Each shot (whether at the hole, or at your opponents) counts as one stroke.

Artillery hots can only be taken at targets in LoS of one of your units.  They are done with guess range, i.e. 36" up and 5 " over, and deviation dice.

The APCs they used had a .50-cal mount, so they could spot, provide point defense, or go on hunting expeditions to try to kill other peoples' units.

It invariably ended up with one person deciding they were too far behind to ever win and charging around the board trying to kill other players.  The other players were then trying to complete their game while avoiding the "berzerker" player, often sending their APCs to perform interception missions.

If a player died, they lost the hole they were on and had to go back to start the _previous_ hole over, so it was a pretty steep penalty for dying.

He said they would all laugh and admit it was completely goony, but they had a blast and usually played a big round every 6 months or so.

We're going to work out a ruleset to work with EA.  I'll be sure to post them when we do.

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 Post subject: Oh No they say he's got to.........
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:01 pm 
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Jaldon, I like it!

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